Matt Cutts just made me laugh out loud in a comment on his blog. (emphasis mine)
I’m definitely not saying that “people that do SEO are bad” (at all), or even that sites that embrace blackhat SEO are likely to cut corners in business. Just that sites that embrace really really bad blackhat SEO are perhaps a tiny fractional bit more likely to cut other corners than regular businesses. That opinion comes from seeing some examples over the years like the one that I mentioned in my post.
I mean there’s obviously just plain old run of the mill ’blackhat SEO’ which I understand resides somewhere along the dark hidden recesses in the subterranean sewers of the SEOsphere - So I can imagine that ‘bad blackhat SEO’ must be pretty ugly in comparison, positively residing in some place a whole lot worse than that perhaps.
Continuing down the scale there would be that ‘really bad blackhat seo’ stuff which just kind of makes me shake and quiver and almost vomit. I can’t even begin to imagine the blackhearted evilness that folks who practice this kinda stuff get up to. Jeepers, its a scary thought to behold.
So I’m imagining that ‘really really bad blackhat SEO’ stuff is the triple xxx rated super dooper nasty nasty nasty stuff practiced by the most heinous of the heinous, whilst possibly imbibing on babies blood.
How would you rate the various gradations? Or is Matt just adding to that very subtle message of PPC good, SEO bad, albeit tiny fractionally…
If you really really liked this post you might even want to buy me a Stella Artois :D
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Terry Reeves - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 8th, 2008 at 8:54 pmNow was he referring to bad in the evil way or bad in the “I can’t believe they are that stupid” way. Because I have seen that last type of BH BS and it always makes me shake my head and smile a little.
I guess they figure, so many web sites, how will they ever know?
pittfall - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 8th, 2008 at 9:07 pmThis is what I think Matt’s scale is:
Online Marketer
Marketer
Whitehat
Mother-in-Law
Greyhat SEO
Politician
Lawyer
Blackhat
Spammer
Bad Blackhat
Really Bad Blackhat
Really Really Bad Blackhat
robwatts - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 8th, 2008 at 10:55 pm@pitfall - Now that’s a scale - love the MIL placement
@Terry - it would be great to hear a definition.
if (Blackhat SEO == bait and switch useragent cloaking) {
$guyisadirtyspammer = true;
}
Then what does really really bad blackhat seo actually equate to?
I doubt we’ll get a definitive, but its crystal clear (in my lil head) what the subtext is, and it isn’t pro SEO!
David Airey - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 9th, 2008 at 9:35 amThat’s nothing.
A friend of my uncle’s stepsister recently told a chilling tale of a ludicrously bad blackhat SEOer.
I can’t say anymore about it.
robwatts - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 9th, 2008 at 9:39 amEek! Ludicrously bad! Bone chilling - I think I need to go and lie down.
David Airey - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 9th, 2008 at 9:42 amSorry Rob.
I shouldn’t have.
SEO Tracy - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 10th, 2008 at 12:20 pmPitfall your scale is quite accurate, but I have to wonder where a real estate agent comes in. With their cheesy head shots and the ads bragging about sales, general opinion puts them in comparison to lawyers with the public.
Igor The Troll - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 11th, 2008 at 8:56 amRob, I think Matt has been hanging around Deap Throat in parking garages too long while working at NSA, so he does not like Black Hats and Gray Coats..:)
robwatts - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 11th, 2008 at 9:32 amIgor, whilst I appreciate that you are simply expressing your contempt for Matt in your own inimitable way, I must add that my blog isn’t really the place to do it. At least not in the style you just used.
I’m more than happy to discuss issues that stem from statements like I’ve referenced above, but please try to remember that this isn’t an attack Matt or attack Google blog!
Thanks
Igor The Troll - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 11th, 2008 at 9:55 amRob, I have no intention or the need to attack Google or Matt, they are doing a good job at that themselves. I am just using some Black Hat Humor.
robwatts - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 11th, 2008 at 10:28 amLOL - black hat humour…now that’s funny!
p.s you might want to login and out again, the url field in your cookie has a comma in it…
Igor The Troll - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 11th, 2008 at 11:13 amHey Rob, anyone takes anything that someone says on the Net as personal they better get a next door cave to Bin Laden. The Net is full of Worm Holes..:)
I was just doing security work for WikiPedia and this what I got as compensation for my hard work.
http://naturalhealthperspective.net/2008/01/10/john-gohde-sad-and-predictable/
Talk about Stalking and Fixation. I feel like Princess Dee with all the Paparazzi. I need to get a per of Ray bans and join MIB, or MI5 as you Brits like to call it. But I think Masada is my calling card being me is an Israelite.
So imagine if what I just said was True ™ that would be some Sardonic Humor!
robwatts - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 11th, 2008 at 11:55 amWell - ultimately, for me and many others I’m sure it’s all down to respect; these walled communities can very quickly take on a lord of the flies mentality which if you dare challenge or borderline troll then…you know the drill.
You see, I can say what I like here, it’s my blog I can rant, yell, swear but at the same time, I also have to think about what i write and how what I say impacts those who read me, because ultimately, SEO and search stuff is what I do, it pays my bills. I have had clients, I now have a new employer, I have potential partners, allies etc all of whom I want to work with in some way and be productive with. Consequently, this spills over into other areas that I participate too; in essence my rep follows me around, the net for the robwatts identity at least is not an anonymous place. If I were to go to other places and be aggressively verbal on their spaces then I shouldn’t be too surprised if they hit back or take exception. At the same time, is it not what we say, but how we say it? There are many ways of describing a thing of ugliness; the words we use to do so speak volumes of our character and no doubt inform the responses of those taking the time to respond.
At the same time yes, if we worried too much what others said about us then we’d be very paranoid indeed. I guess that at some point it comes down to how you’d like to be perceived/received. If you show no respect then you’ll get little back, if you agitate with malice then you’ll probably get back the same too.
Anyhow, this is a little OT to the thread! The bottom line for me is keep it civil. Lose your rag, you lose the argument.
Igor The Troll - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 11th, 2008 at 9:34 pmRob, I totally agree with you.
pittfall - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 12th, 2008 at 12:48 amTracy, I didn’t think there were any real estate agents left…
Igor The Troll - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 14th, 2008 at 6:19 amSo Rob, did we make this post worth of good SEO or it is still Black Hat Turd..:) But then the saying goes, if God gives you Turds make gold out of them!
robwatts - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 14th, 2008 at 9:12 amIgor, I guess that technically you could say that it does indeed relate to stuff that is black hat turd, yet alas not of too much use to anyone trying to learn about the topic. Other than perhaps, a little look at how one particular mover and shaker sees the whole shaboogle.
As for god, I’d say that god gives us all a lot of choices and that some of these choices may indeed appear to be laden in turd. The key thing is to appreciate the message and learn from the lessons they teach.
Igor The Troll - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 14th, 2008 at 9:38 amRob, spoken like true gentleman. I do enjoy conversing with you. You should come read my blog from time to time, I think it may strike your fancy.
robwatts - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 14th, 2008 at 9:50 amIgor, you’re not such a bad old stick yourself, for a troll
I’ll most certainly take the time to do that, maybe you should edit your post links and advertise your blog too.
Take it easy.
Igor The Troll - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 14th, 2008 at 9:57 amRob, my blog is not about the masses but a few enlightened souls!
Blackhat - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 19th, 2008 at 2:24 amwell right now all the really bad black hat seo webmasters are fighting over scraps, most of their huge scraper sites have been dumped and banished to supplemental results, only the elite will survive, only the best black hat seo ‘ers know how not to trip those filters in the algo
Igor The Troll - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 19th, 2008 at 8:14 amBlack Hat today, maybe no Hat tomorrow. I would not be boasting if I were a Black Hat!
Alibata - Really really bad blackhat SEO
January 20th, 2008 at 10:33 amWell you can really tell if a site is using Black Hat or White Hat or both. They use those Hats just to get Clients to buy their services.
Jayson - Really really bad blackhat SEO
February 15th, 2008 at 10:03 pmI think Matt makes a good point. If a business is willing to throw away their Internet business when they get caught, who says their not going to throw away my business on the drop of a dime. It’s a business choice and I can’t see businesses that plan on lasting embracing really really bad black hat seo.
Justin - Really really bad blackhat SEO
May 8th, 2008 at 12:26 amI agree with Matt’s comment. I don’t see BH as bad, but I’d never use it on any legit site. Its just too much risk and a short term tactic. Too dumb to use for a long term site.
And the scale toward the top of the comments is great